The Prince by Machiavelli- 6th group 1
The Prince by Machiavelli- 6th Hour part 1
During this fishbowl there will be a discussion taking place on the inside of the fishbowl and a blogging discussion on the outside of the circle. As you are blogging on the outside of the circle you need to present higher level questions and comments that you have in regards to the reading. We will notice that the conversations will be different but will overlap themselves in areas. You are encourage to participate both on the inside and the outside of the circle.Remember, pose original thought provoking questions/comments that tie this piece of literature into the study of the Renaissance.
During this fishbowl there will be a discussion taking place on the inside of the fishbowl and a blogging discussion on the outside of the circle. As you are blogging on the outside of the circle you need to present higher level questions and comments that you have in regards to the reading. We will notice that the conversations will be different but will overlap themselves in areas. You are encourage to participate both on the inside and the outside of the circle.Remember, pose original thought provoking questions/comments that tie this piece of literature into the study of the Renaissance.
posted by Alison | 12:14 PM
46 Comments:
I think that people are able to choose their own actions because how boring would life be if every choice that we made was prepared for us. OF course their are outside influences that help or guide our descions in a certain direction
jenn r. reply I think that he thinks that men are like that because he was taken out of a power posistion and then wrote this book on how to rule and then his work was banned for every to see. But i think he thinks that men are more selfish and not loving becacuse he says "for men will more easily forget they death of their father than the loss of their worldly goods"
"it is better to be loved than feared or feared than loved? one ought to be both feared and loved." i think it is better to be loved then feard because what is fear gonna do when you are not loved?
My favorite quote is, "I shall look at the facts of politics rather than take my evidence form imaging government which have never really existed.
"Is it better to be loved more than feared or feared more than loved?"
I think that is is better to be loved than to be feared. I believe this because I think it's more enjoyable to be liked and loved. If I'm loved/liked then I know that I'm behaving in a acceptable manner. I just don't understand how someone would want to be feared. How would anyone enjoy you and how could you enjoy anyone else if they all were afraid of you? What are your thoughts?
Machiavelli states that " it is much safer to be feared then to be loved". wouldn't you if you were a rulere want every one to love you so you wouldn't have the fear of corruption and assaination after you like the king in antigone had?
I thnk that the author is contradicting himself the way he believes governments condrict themselves
I think people are in control of most of their actions. I agree with Machiavelli and somethimes you are able to make decisions because you are fortunate. If you have certain qualities and other things you can decide more of your actions For example, someone who wants to go to college and can have a major career can decided more action than someone who doesn't want to go to college and work at Buger King, their actions are decided for them.
Jenn... great point about him loosing his position in government! Is his resentment towards the previous government found throughout this reading? Examples?
Chelby! i think being generous is a right thing to be. you hear the saying " good things happen to good people" where would you get in life when you are not generous? being selfish and rude will not get you places.
so in the quote i think he is right by saying that.
To what rach said I think if the government fears the people then they will do what the majority of the people want the government in return will respect the people out of fear. I necessarily don't think that that is a bad thing.
One of my favorite quotes is "there is big difference how we live and how we ought to live"... is this a necessity in the role of government...
I think that people can control only some of their actions. They can control what they decide for themselves but the outcome could be different if an outside "force" acts upon it.
my quote is " since a prince cannot exercise the viryue of liberality without risking his position he must not object too much to being called miserly."
does government have two faces? one of how they want to be percieved and one of what they really do?
is this the only way to govern?
Do you think that Nicclol Machiavelli wanted to be a prince? This way no one would be able to kick him out of the govt. or tell him how to rule. Maybe he made his work this contradicting for that reason, he is the best since he wrote how you should act so he should be put into power
I think how we ought to live should be the way we live. However I can see how this quote explains how governments need to act because sometimes there are crazy people out there and these people need to be held accountable for their actions if the majority of people don't approve or live by them.
justine and chelby ur right i agree u have to help people out in life to get anywere... good thinkin!
like most of us have said they would be loved more than feared, but who would want to be feared?
i dont get it why would someone be feared more than loved? is it because they want to be strong and not seen as a softy? and not hold thier guards down?
sorry i cant spell either im just readt for the weekend!
i believe what allyson said when she stated the church running the government. On the first page a quote in the fourth paragraph "PopeJulius II used his reputation for lierality in order to get elected to the papacy, but he is really being liberal to all those from whom he does not collect higher taxes
about one of mcbride MANY comments (im just joking but really thats is a little too much tho think about on a friday... or amybe its just me.)i think the government has two faces in today's society. I dont konw if the government was two-faced when this guy wrote it but i think that the press has had a lot to do with it. but maybe the government has always been two-faced...
i think that if you have a job in the government you have to be some what feared because you need to get your point across rather than being stepped on all the time, but i know i will never be in politics so i would rather be loved than feared
i no justine i would way rather have love then be feared cuz then u wouldnt have very many friends and it would suck!!! and i no im ready for the weekend to just like 20 mins left lol yay!!!
suzanne, you right on that part bein feared is more safer but i dont know if im readin this rigt? if you are feared you are more loved and respected? im probably reading this wrong but how would you be loved if your feared?
Justine it is like the slaves. if you let them love you then people thought that they would get confidence and be happy and feel posivite emotions, but when you install fear and make them want to advoid you, then they 'stay in order' and keep there heads down. This way they won't do any thing rash. maybe installing fear is not just for mostly for one person, but for a group
quote to think about...
"men are so simple minded that anyone who wants to be deceitful can always find those who will allow themselves to be deceived"
is this true...????
I believe that in life is it good to be loved in general. However i think that when it comes to a person's government they should stnad up for what they believe in no matter what. I thnk that this can be precived
well justine i agree theres no love in being feared unless ur the persons mom or somthing but if the mom fears u then maybe she doesnt love u either that would suck to be feared man o man!!!
Responding to Rachel's comment, I think that "preach peace and good faithm but he is really a great enemy to both" does represent today's government. For example, in today's war our president always tells the U.S. that we are making progress and that we will one day be out of Iraq, however this is an enemy because this is all a matter of opinion. Some people believe that we are in this war for no reason and others believe that we are there to fight terrorism. The main point,though, is that preaching only peace and food faith is like a shelter. It's great to be positive but this possibly closes off truth.
when i think of being feared more than loved all i think of is this huge tought guy all dressed in black and with tattoos and who thinks that they can depend on themselfs and no one else but in the end isnt that person gonna get lonely
as fear sorry i did not finish. I think that to Ms. Mcbride's comment the men is reffering to people in general and the people running the government are simple minded along with the voters.
Okay i have a question: What does this quote mean?
"It is not at all necessary for a prince to have all the good qualities which i have named,..."
So how come he explains all of them and why it would be useful to have those qualities? i think he is just trying to use up paper.
annie lo Are the voters simple minded or is the govt teaching them only what they need to know
does more fear mean more respect?
justine ur right yet again!!! good call i no i think of a huge freakin guy walkin around and dancin a little bit on his motor cycle riding off and biteing people like a lil meany! but somtimes theres those big tuff guys like on aurther binky yea hes big and tuff but hes a nice guys too!!!!
"if he had kept the peace and observed good faith, he would have lost his position and his reputation in may occasions." - i disagree
maybe thoughs are the quailties that he has and he is saying that no one will ever be able to match up to me
I think respect is stonger then fear. If you are respected more people will want to do things for you instead of having to do things for you. You can carry respect a lot further than fear. Fear is not a positive attribute so why would you want to posses that?
jenn, when does the point of fear reaches hatred? when it does reach that stage what happens? if you are ruling through fear thus coming closer to hatred... what determines that they have crossed over the line?
I agree with Jenn's comment about the government "A prince should be careful to kane himself feared in such a way that if men do not love him, they at least do not hate him. I think that is also plays back into the love Vs. hate thing.
chelby what did you think about when on the frist page the prince is talking about beeing rich is better than being poor?
suzanne... great point! is that okay? is there away to hold one accountable?
Dear chelby i thought he was a loser because he talked about how he thought being rich was better then being poor because u get more respect! i dont agree with that i think get respect has anything to do with money i thinks its all on ur personality!!!
haha good example alyson
favorite quote right here: " ...she is always a friend to the young, because they are less cuatious, more fierce, and master her with great audacity." so how come there has never been a female prez. stupid boys
to Chelby's comment If you look what we are doing right now in Iraq wouldn you count that as evil. Maye not in our eyes but in their's
Post a Comment
<< Home